The Drake Passage Impact Event

The Drake Passage Impact Event

A remarkable series of comments by Jim Coyle describes The Drake Passage as a massive “impact trench”.

Jim Coyle says: December 21, 2013 at 21:35

This is phenomenal and answers a lot of my questions about geologic and geographic entities.

You should try looking at The Drake passage between South America and Antartica.

On Google earth you will see a definite crater and impact trench, also possibly 3 smaller craters in a small cluster just to the north of it.

The main crater has a classic double wall rim but the smaller hits appear to have filled in the west side of the crater so no rebound cone or ridge is visible.

The smaller craters do have central cone features.

On one of your maps showing impacts around the globe I noticed one on about the same latitude but further west of what I’m proposing.

Could be a 5th related hit kind of daisy chaining?

Drake Passage - Primary and Secondary Impact Craters

Jim Coyle says: December 22, 2013 at 14:44

You need to move to the east to see the double ring leading edge of the main crater.

Also pull back a little bit more for a larger view.

You will se how the 2 landmasses are pulled to the east with the impact and you’ll also see the 2, possibly 3 craters to the north and just behind the main one.

Jim Coyle says: December 26, 2013 at 17:09

As I was checking things out I looked for any climate changes in the 33 million yr range and found that was when Antartica started to glaciate.

At that same time there was a down turn in atmospheric CO2. Coincidence?

The mainstream Age of the Ocean Floor suggests The Drake Passage Impact Event occurred around 33 million years ago.

Drake Passage - Sea Floor Age

This dating places The Drake Passage Impact Event at the start of the Oligocene.

The Oligocene is a geologic epoch of the Paleogene Period and extends from about 33.9 million to 23 million years before the present (33.9±0.1 to 23.03±0.05 Ma).

As with other older geologic periods, the rock beds that define the period are well identified but the exact dates of the start and end of the period are slightly uncertain.

Therefore, it is unsurprising that the mainstream associates the start of the Oligocene with “a notable extinction event called the Grande Coupure”.

The start of the Oligocene is marked by a notable extinction event called the Grande Coupure; it featured the replacement of European fauna with Asian fauna, except for the endemic rodent and marsupial families. By contrast, the Oligocene-Miocene boundary is not set at an easily identified worldwide event but rather at regional boundaries between the warmer late Oligocene and the relatively cooler Miocene.

The Grande Coupure, or “great break” in continuity, with a major European turnover in mammalian fauna about 33.5 Ma, marks the end of the last phase of Eocene assemblages, the Priabonian, and the arrival in Europe of Asian immigrants. The Grande Coupure is characterized by widespread extinctions and allopatric speciation in small isolated relict populations

Extinction Intensity

The mainstream failure to recognise The Drake Passage Impact Event has resulted in considerable debate over when The Drake Passage actually opened and confusion regarding the dramatic changes in ocean circulation [and heat distribution] that were triggered by this impact event.

Antarctica Oceanic Crust

The Oligocene sees the beginnings of modern ocean circulation, with tectonic shifts causing the opening and closing of ocean gateways.

Cooling of the oceans had already commenced by the Eocene/Oligocene boundary, and they continued to cool as the Oligocene progressed.

The formation of permanent Antarctic ice sheets during the early Oligocene and possible glacial activity in the Arctic may have influenced this oceanic cooling, though the extent of this influence is still a matter of some significant dispute.

The effects of oceanic gateways on circulation
The opening and closing of ocean gateways: the opening of the Drake Passage; the opening of the Tasmanian Gateway and the closing of the Tethys seaway; along with the final formation of the Greenland-Iceland-Faroes sill; played vital parts in reshaping oceanic currents during the Oligocene.

As the continents shifted to a more modern configuration, so too did ocean circulation.

The Drake Passage
The Drake Passage is located between South America and Antarctica.

Once the Tasmanian Gateway between Australia and Antarctica opened, all that kept Antarctica from being completely isolated by the Southern Ocean was its connection to South America.

As the South American continent moved north, the Drake Passage opened and enabled the formation of the Antarctic Circumpolar Current (ACC), which would have kept the cold waters of Antarctica circulating around that continent and strengthened the formation of Antarctic Bottom Water (ABW).

With the cold water concentrated around Antarctica, sea surface temperatures and, consequently, continental temperatures would have dropped.

The onset of Antarctic glaciation occurred during the early Oligocene, and the effect of the Drake Passage opening on this glaciation has been the subject of much research.

However, some controversy still exists as to the exact timing of the passage opening, whether it occurred at the start of the Oligocene or nearer the end.

Even so, many theories agree that at the Eocene/Oligocene (E/O) boundary, a yet shallow flow existed between South America and Antarctica, permitting the start of an Antarctic Circumpolar Current.

Stemming from the issue of when the opening of the Drake Passage took place, is the dispute over how great of an influence the opening of the Drake Passage had on the global climate.

While early researchers concluded that the advent of the ACC was highly important, perhaps even the trigger, for Antarctic glaciation and subsequent global cooling, other studies have suggested that the δ18O signature is too strong for glaciation to be the main trigger for cooling.

Through study of Pacific ocean sediments, other researchers have shown that the transition from warm Eocene ocean temperatures to cool Oligocene ocean temperatures took only 300,000 years, which strongly implies that feedbacks and factors other than the ACC were integral to the rapid cooling.

The Late Oligocene opening of the Drake Passage
The latest-hypothesized time for the opening of the Drake Passage is during the early Miocene.

Despite the shallow flow between South America and Antarctica, there was not enough of a deep water opening to allow for significant flow to create a true Antarctic Circumpolar Current.

If the opening occurred as late as hypothesized, then the Antarctic Circumpolar Current could not have had much of an effect on early Oligocene cooling, as it would not have existed.

The Early Oligocene Opening of the Drake Passage
The earliest-hypothesized time for the opening of the Drake Passage is around 30 Ma.

One of the possible issues with this timing was the continental debris, as it were, cluttering up the seaway between the two plates in question.

This debris, along with what is known as the Shackleton Fracture Zone, has been shown in a recent study to be fairly young, only about 8 million years old.

The aforementioned study concludes that the Drake Passage would be free to allow significant deep water flow by around 31 Ma.

This would have facilitated an earlier onset of the Antarctic Circumpolar Current.

Currently, an opening of the Drake Passage during the early Oligocene is favored.

The Opening of the Tasman Gateway
The other major oceanic gateway opening during this time was the Tasman, or Tasmanian, depending on the paper, gateway between Australia and Antarctica.

The time frame for this opening is less disputed than the Drake Passage and is largely considered to have occurred around 34 Ma.

As the gateway widened, the Antarctic Circumpolar Current strengthened.

The Tethys Seaway Closing
Though the Tethys was not a gateway, but rather a sea in its own right.

Its closing during the Oligocene had significant impact on both ocean circulation and climate.

The collisions of the African plate with the European plate and of the Indian subcontinent with the Asian plate, cut off the Tethys seaway that had provided a low-latitude ocean circulation.

The closure of Tethys built some new mountains (the Zagros range) and drew down more carbon dioxide from the atmosphere, contributing to global cooling.

The gradual separation of the clump of continental crust and the deepening of tectonic sill in the North Atlantic that would become Greenland, Iceland, and the Faroe Islands helped to increase the deep water flow in that area.

Ocean Cooling
Evidence for ocean-wide cooling during the Oligocene exists mostly in isotopic proxies.

Patterns of extinction and patterns of species migration can also be studied to gain insight into ocean conditions.

For a while, it was thought that the glaciation of Antarctica may have significantly contributed to the cooling of the ocean, however, recent evidence tends to deny this.

Deep Water
Isotopic evidence suggests that during the early Oligocene, the main source of deep water was the North Pacific and the Southern Ocean.

As the Greenland-Iceland-Faroe sill deepened and thereby connected the Norwegian-Greenland sea with the Atlantic Ocean, the deep water of the North Atlantic began to come into play as well.

Computer models suggest that once this occurred, a more modern in appearance thermo-haline circulation started.

North Atlantic Deep Water
Evidence for the early Oligocene onset of chilled North Atlantic Deep Water lies in the beginnings of sediment drift deposition in the North Atlantic, such as the Feni and Southeast Faroe drifts

South Ocean Deep Water
The chilling of the South Ocean Deep Water began in earnest once the Tasmanian Gateway and the Drake Passage opened fully.

Regardless of the time at which the opening of the Drake Passage occurred, the effect on the cooling of the Southern Ocean would have been the same.

The Drake Passage Impact Event provides intriguing insights into the Ice Age Paradox where additional oceanic heat is required to drive precipitation and ice accumulation in Polar Regions.

Firstly, the establishment of the Antarctic Circumpolar Current and the Thermo-Haline Circulation cooled the tropical oceans and warmed the polar oceans.

Thermo-Haline Conveyor Belt

Secondly, the heat released via seafloor spreading helped drive the global Thermo-Haline Circulation and increased precipitation over Greenland, Norway and around Antarctica.

Seafloor Crust Age 1996

Thirdly, the establishment of the Antarctic Circumpolar Current and Thermo-Haline Circulation ensured that the climate changed on a global scale.

Whether this abrupt change was caused by climate change associated with the earliest polar glaciations and a major fall in sea levels, or by competition with taxa dispersing from Asia, few argue for an isolated single cause.

More spectacular possible causes are related to the impact of one or more large bolides in northern hemisphere at Popigai, Toms Canyon and Chesapeake Bay.

Improved correlation of northwest European successions to global events confirms the Grande Coupure as occurring in the earliest Oligocene, with a hiatus of about 350 millennia prior to the first record of post-Grande Coupure Asian immigrant taxa.

Phanerozoic Climate Change

Intriguingly, the relationship between sea floor spreading and global temperatures appear to have been closely correlated for the last 180 million years.

Seafloor Spreading and Temperature

Unsurprisingly, the rate of seafloor spreading is also closely correlated with sea level for the last 180 million years.

Seafloor spreading and Sea Level

Unsurprisingly, the Drake Passage Impact Event [at the start of Oligocene] provides further support for the Inflating Earth and Increasing Terrestrial Gravity theories.

An element of the paradigm of the Grande Coupure was the apparent extinction of all European primates at the Coupure: the recent discovery of a mouse-sized early Oligocene omomyid, reflecting the better survival chances of small mammals, further undercut the Grand Coupure paradigm.



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50 Responses to The Drake Passage Impact Event

  1. Jim Coyle says:

    MalagaBay; Who am I dealing with here? Is this one person or a panel of researchers?

  2. malagabay says:

    Jim: The postings on Malaga Bay are by a single person: Tim Cullen

  3. Jim Coyle says:

    thank you. SometimesI wonder who I’m dealing with at some other sites. I appreciate your time and candor. As I come up with other ideas or theories I’ll be sure to post. If anything sounds out of bounds please feel free to wack me on the knuckles .

    Thank you for your input… I look forward to reading more…
    and please feel free to “wack me on the knuckles” when you think I am “out of bounds”.

  4. Jim Coyle says:

    malagabay; Does anyone out there know if there are any significant changes in atmospheric CO2 levels after a cosmic impact or major vulcanism event?

  5. In the expanding earth theory how do you explain how the continental land masses appear to have been under water on occasion. This includes a large section of N Africa and Europe

    Before the opening up of the oceanic basins [via inflation] around 200 million years ago [mainstream timeline] surface water formed “lakes” and “seas” in endorheic basins on the Earth’s surface.

    The Inflating Earth: 1 – Seafloor Stretching

    The Inflating Earth – Sea Level

    Exothermic Terrestrial Degassing of Hydrogen and Helium

    The Chalky Cretaceous: 2 – The Eye of the Sahara

    Geology: Going Down The Tubes

    Liesegang Rings: 5 – Geological Quicksand

  6. malagabay says:

    The history of CO2 seems far from “settled”.

    However, it seems that the carbon in CO2 slowly gets stripped away so that O2 accumulates in the atmosphere.

    My research has touched upon the historic relationship between CO2 and O2.

    Amber Nectar and the Oxygen Paradox

    And the relationship between seafloor spreading and O2.

    Tektites: 3 – Still Waters Run Deep

    Establishing the holistic history of the Earth is a “work in progress”.

    Based upon my research [to date] the evidence suggests:

    1) Massive impacts trigger Inflation.
    2) Inflation is associated with the outgassing of CO2, H2O, Nitrogen and Helium.

    ==>> H2O accumulates in the newly opened oceanic basins
    ==>> The photo-dissociation of atmospheric H2O allows Hydrogen to escape into the Exosphere while Oxygen accumulates in the lower atmosphere.

    ==>> Helium accumulates in the lower exosphere.

    ==>> Nitrogen accumulates in the lower atmosphere.

    ==>> The carbon in atmospheric CO2 is slowly removed by the biosphere and the resultant O2 accumulates in the atmosphere.


  7. Jim Coyle says:

    Tim; I been looking around for any info on the possible drake pssage impacts and came up with some more tidbits. I finally got around to scaling the sites and found the 1st and 2nd hits on the North side of the main trench and are approx 200 mi dia. The main (3rd) impact is over 600mi dia. The 4th impact is approx 200mi dia and overlaps the 3rd hit. There appears to be 2 trenches. The main one is over1500 mi long and aproximately 4000m deep. This the same as the southern sea. The 2nd trench is fairly shallow but noticeable. Both trenches show signs of pushing sea floor sediments out in front of them for quite a distance. I was wondering why there are no tektites found in the area but they would have been covewreed with ice a long time ago. Also would tektite formation have happened at the initial impact or when the linear motion ceased. I’m also curious as to whether this impact could have put the Eastward spin on the Antarctic plate that it has today.

  8. malagabay says:

    Interesting… I wondered about the tektites… and I wondered whether an impact into deep water would make any difference… unfortunately I don’t have any answers… but I’ll keep looking for [and following] the evidence.

  9. Jim Coyle says:

    I have been reading about research being done by DR Ian Daziel on the age of the Drake trench and Scotia plate. He has been using the basket drag method to collect bottom samples of rock and debris. After removing all the drop stones from icebergs the remaining rock is volcanogenic, but ages around 12mya. I believe if there was volcanism covering the bottom basemant rock then you would have to dip or drill deeper to get to the basemant stone. If a large impact or swarm was big enough to move the Andes mountains 1200 mi east and dig a trench 4000 meters deep into the ocean floor I’m willing to bet that it may have cracked the earths mantle creating the flows on the Scotia plate. Quite similar to the Deccan and Siberian traps or the Snake river Basalts in the U.S. The Deccan and Siberian traps have asscosiated craters but none has been found for the Snake river, could be already buried under the basalt flows. Any comments or info directions are more than welcome.

  10. Jim Coyle says:

    I was given a calculator for sizing an impact’s crater. I already know the crate volume but used the calculator to try and find the size, speed and angle of the impactor. By taking a little license ( guessing) with the input figures I was able to recreate a crater quite close to the Drake Passage in appearance. In the description of the crater from the calc program it mentioned that approximately 1/2 of the impact melt would flow back into the crater. Could this be the volcanigenic composition of the Scotia Plate descrbed by Dr Daliea.

  11. malagabay says:

    It looks like the Scotia Plate is the trench with the East Scotia Ridge marking its eastern boundary while also being the western boundary of the volcanically active Sandwich Plate which is “moving rapidly eastward, at rates from 65 to 90 mm/yr” with the South Sandwich Trench at the leading edge… so arguably the kinetic energy of the very low angled impact is still be dissipated.

    Take a look at the full USGS poster [at the link below]… you might see it differently….

    USGS poster of the South Sandwich Islands, Scotia Sea, Earthquake of 20 August 2006 – Magnitude 7.0

    South Sandwich Plate

    The region near the Scotia Sea in the southern Atlantic Ocean is a complex area of marginal basins bordered by the South America and Antarctic plates.

    The boundary motion between these two larger plates is predominately strike-slip.

    The South America-Antarctic plate motion is left lateral at about 15 mm/yr, with the Scotia Plate twisting between the two.

    There does not appear to be any north-south compression of the Scotia Plate.

    However, pure strike-slip earthquakes do not represent all the motion between the Scotia Sea and Antarctic plates.

    Partitioning occurs on one or both of the Scotia Sea boundaries.

    Modeled motions are consistent with the existence of a rigid Scotia Sea Plate.

    Beyond the eastern end of the Scotia Sea plate, the Sandwich Plate is moving rapidly eastward, at rates from 65 to 90 mm/yr. This forms an eastern flank of the spreading system behind the South Sandwich Arc.

  12. Jim Coyle says:

    The impact suggested here may have created the Scotia plate by fracuring the SouthAmerican or the Antartic plate or both. The forward momentum forced the Scotia plate to suduct under the Sandwich while forcing the Sandwich plate into its Eastward movement at a lower rate than the Scotia plate. The lateral volcanism activity is probably caused byplate slippage keeping the fracture vone in an open state.

  13. Jim Coyle says:

    Tim; In reading some information about the Phoenix Ridge it stated that the Basalt floor of Drake Passage is the exact same composition as the Pacific floor Basalts. I would take that to mean that eihter the floor in the Passage was pushed eastward by plate tectonics as is conventioal thinking or it was pulled through by a cosmic impact. I’m geeting a stronger feeling that this just might be the case.

  14. J Martin says:

    This pdf posits simultaneous impacts, the Drake Passage and the Carribean.

    Click to access Geologic-Sensemaking-Simultaneous-Impacts-10May2013.pdf


  15. Jim Coyle says:

    J Martin; Thank you for the link. This is just the ticket for the thread I’m trying to establish. Sometimes you have to step back and look at the bigger picture. I just haven’t looked big enough. Again Thanks.

  16. Jim Coyle says:

    J Martin; Is that your own work or did you come across it somewhere else on the net? I would like to use it for presentation but would like to have the proper people getting credit for their work.

  17. J Martin says:

    Not mine. I got it from a comment at Chiefio’s.

  18. Coyle, James says:

    Thanks a lot for the help. Hopefully nothings is screwed up.

  19. malagabay says:

    Another interesting perspective:

    Bidecadal Thermal Changes in the Abyssal Ocean

    Bidecadal Thermal Changes in the Abyssal Ocean
    Carl Wunsch – Patrick Heimbach

    Click to access heatcontentchange_26dec2013_ph.pdf

  20. jim Coyle says:

    Tim; I was thinking about how far the Scotia Plate had subducted since the opening of the Drake Passage. I used your info of 65-90mm/yr to back calculate the distance of subduction. At the present rate using 75mm/yr as an average the Scotia Plate has moved approximately 4691.35miles in 34m/yr. That puts the impact out in the Pacific Ocean about equal-distance as it is into the Atlantic ocean now. I believe this to be over simplistic as I can’t see how the entire ocean floor has moved that far and kept the impact structures as seen intact, but I also don’t know how the Pacific ocean floor was dragged that far into the Atlantic to begin with. All of this seems to more indications of a major impact 34mya.

  21. malagabay says:

    I tried a similar “back of a fag packet” calculation… threw in a bit deceleration… and concluded:
    1) The standard geological timeframes are probably Disney productions.
    2) The “skate boarding” [or is that “surfing”] dynamics of the Scotia Plate indicate that the standard geological [non-] explanations also seem to be Disney productions.

    My research [so far] has thrown up some interesting threads… and some very curious observations… but it’s a long haul pulling it all together… I still have a long way to go because I haven’t [yet] managed to connect up the dots… but I am very intrigued by the ocean heat content graphic which provides an interesting match with some of the threads I am looking at… Tim

  22. Jim Coyle says:

    I was looking at the heat content maps and was amazed by the high heat content of the currents that supposedly brought glaciation to Antarctica. It appears that the heat is generated all around Antarctica but then it’s pulled north into the tropics to cool then return somewhat cooler but still warm. How does this create continental glaciation? An idea is that when this Impact occurred the continent experienced millenia of nuclear winter, above and beyond what we see now. At this point and time Anarctica may well be in a thaw mode and we just don’t realise it. The ice cover could well have been multi-miles thick causing massive drops in oceanic levels which are only now in the last 20,000 yrs or so rebounding.

  23. Jim Coyle says:

    Jim Coyle
    December 6, 2014 at 11:37 pm
    For Drake Passage, sediments indicate the opening occurred ~41 million years ago while tectonics indicate that this occurred ~32 million years ago.
    The above quote is from Wiki-pedia. I was looking for any info on the landmass positions 334mya and this came up in reference to the opening of the circumpolar current.
    This seems to be a bit confusing and contrary. But I believe that the cosmic impact that I believe happened in the area of Drake passage happened on the Pacific side of South America and dragged the sea floor into the Atlantic ocean basin creating the Drake Passage. The tectonic evidence is from the impact fracturing the earths crust creating the numerous plates in that area of the world and the sediment evidence is from the sea floor being dragged from the Pacific into the Atlantic ocean more or less intact. Another concept is that The Drake Passage has northern siberia as its antipode. This area is known to have had cosmic impacts in the 34mya era. This is mostly speculation but any comments or critiques are appreciated

  24. Jim Coyle says: Tim; I came across this piece about another impact crater discovery in the same time frame as The Drake Passage event

  25. malagabay says:

    Thanks for the heads up… interesting.

  26. Jim Coyle says:

    Steve; I was reading some more on the Mt Ashmore impact crater and decided to draw a line from there to Drake Passage on a flat global map. I also drew a line from Chesapeake Bay, Toms Canyon to Popigai Russia. They appeared to be perfectly parallel. I continued each line to the edge of the map and proved out to continuous. All 4 of these 34-35 mya sites are on the same pass. This must of have been one hell of an impactor to have a 5km impactor at Mt Ashmore, multiple large hits at Drakes Passage, A 84km crater at Chesapeake Bay with a smaller one at Toms Canyon and the monsters at Popigai Russia. I’m not sure how to continue the line around the globe again to see if there are any more crater sites in that alignment. Tim; I copied this from another site that I converse on.

  27. PeterMG says:

    I have been reading the posts hear whilst reading and researching other phenomena. Could it be what we think of as being impact craters are in fact huge electric arc trenches or craters.

  28. Jim Coyle says:

    Peter; I thank you for your post. I don’t subscribe to the electric arc theory in this case because the arc necessary to make craters trenches this size would be beyond my comprehension. My other question in regards to this being electrical in nature is was it incoming or discharging? How would one tell? Where would that amount of electric come from or where would it go to? I’m always open to other ideas and concepts but I also like some kind of factual back ups.

  29. Jim Coyle says:

    In researching possible orbital tracts for my impactor I came across a polar route for a satellite that almost makes all 4 impact sites but it would entail about 3 or 4 orbits to do it so I don’t think it feasible. also with Drake Passage being my initial site with the trenching running generally west to east I feel the path would be running Southwest to Northeast, Drake Passage, Mt Ashmore, Chesepeake Bay and Popigai. If I can continue the line around the globe some more there may be some more sites to investigate that haven’t been considered yet.

  30. Jim Coyle says:

    Tim; Do you know of any realitively easy way to plot 4 points on a globe and connect them with a line to see if they truly are in an alignment.

  31. malagabay says:

    Jim: No.
    Perhaps you could try plotting and comparing “great circle” routes between your “points”.

    Calculate the great circle distance between two points
    This calculator will find the distance between two pairs of coordinates to a very high degree of precision (using the thoroughly nasty Vincenty Formula, which accounts for the flattened shape of the earth).
    The “Draw map” button will show you the two points on a map and draw the great circle route between them.
    GPS Visualizer

    For any two points on the surface of a sphere there is a unique great circle through the two points. An exception is a pair of antipodal points, for which there are infinitely many great circles. The minor arc of a great circle between two points is the shortest surface-path between them. In this sense the minor arc is analogous to “straight lines” in spherical geometry. The length of the minor arc of a great circle is taken as the distance between two points on a surface of a sphere in Riemannian geometry. The great circles are the geodesics of the sphere.

  32. Jim Coyle says:

    Tim; I just found and used a site called GPS Visualizer Free hand drawing. I was able to enter my 4 set points and connect the dots from Drake Passage to Mt Ashmore Australia, to Chesapeake Bay to Popagia Russia. They line up perfectly using 1.5 passes around the earth. I thought there might be a crook or 2 in the line but NO! This was laid over a GE map so I could enlarge it or shrink it and it still worked. As soon as I’m able to save it and send it I will. I can’t believe it actually came out. 4 separate hits at 34mya and they all line up. If I can figure out how to continue the line around again there may be more possible sites or it may go over possible known water hit sites. The object involved had to have been enormous to break 4 times and still leave all these extremely large crater sites, some with multiple hits on the earths surface. This also makes the Grande Coupure make more sense, 2 major hits on the southern hemisphere and 2 major hits on the northern hemisphere could very well cause a global extinction event. Between massive shock waves and massive dust loads I’m sure that most all life forms on earth took a major hit or alteration.

    Interesting 🙂
    Question: Could it have “bounced” [aka “stone skipping”]?

  33. Jim Coyle says:

    I believe that skipping would not be the case here because to skip approx. 1.5 orbits of the earth without stopping would require 1- a very low angle of entry which I don’t think could be sustained because of momentum loss at each strike. 2- the first and second strikes were fairly close the second and third strikes were quite distance and the third and fourth strikes were fairly close again. This does not follow skipping patterns that show progressively shorter distances between strikes. 3- The speed needed to keep an object the size required to make the series of craters mentioned aloft just for breakup over 1.5 orbits is incredible. The amount needed to skip four x is unfathomable. I had considered the skipping idea but had to give it up due to the above reasoning

  34. PeterMG says:

    Just a thought. Everything I thought I understood 2 years ago in cosmology physics and earth sciences I now know is likely wrong. Its wrong because it not connected. You can’t cherry pick between theories in order to form an understanding. The solution to understanding our world has to be interdisciplinary. So having said all of that I’m beginning to understand that our radiometric dating could all be to hell, in fact if history teaches us anything, it is that it is definitely all to hell.

    So the pretty graphics of sea floor age could represent only thousands of years and not millions of years. The events you are trying to unpick here could of been a part of the catastrophes that are recorded by early man, perhaps only 10, 20 30 thousand years ago. Or perhaps not, how can we be sure.

    I’m not an expert with fossils and the history of life on earth but there is a strange gap between what they call 65 million years ago and up to a couple of million years ago. That time chronology is only valid if earth and the solar system have been exactly as they are now for 4 billion years or so. I don’t believe that is so which leaves us with a bit of a problem.

    Question is am I on the right wavelength here or reading too much into the problems of science. Should I stop reading Velikovsky and watching Electric universe video’s.

  35. malagabay says:

    My perspective is that you are on the “right wavelength”.
    So keep on researching… keep on thinking… and use the Scientific Method.

    The scientific method is a body of techniques for investigating phenomena, acquiring new knowledge, or correcting and integrating previous knowledge.
    To be termed scientific, a method of inquiry is commonly based on empirical or measurable evidence subject to specific principles of reasoning.
    The Oxford English Dictionary defines the scientific method as “a method or procedure that has characterized natural science since the 17th century, consisting in systematic observation, measurement, and experiment, and the formulation, testing, and modification of hypotheses.”

  36. Jim Coyle says:

    Peter; At this point in time We can’t say positively yes, there are many variables involved. I have found that there are many people who say Drake Passage is just plate tectonics nothing more or less. There are some that will say: It’s possible , keep digging. I’m dealing with settled science data whether it’s right or wrong it’s all I have at this point and time. Maybe someone with more resources and time will pick up the ball and try a run with it. My view is that there are at least 4-6 impact craters in that are in the immediate vicinity, and each of the other 3 major recorded and confirmed sites are major multiple hit sites that appear to be linked in a linear spiraling fashion. The impact structures are readily visible on Goggle earth, but that’s just me and who am I? As I said before I’m always open to ideas and suggestions. Some are out there and others are plausible. Any help or direction is appreciated. Don’t stop reading Velikovsky or electric universe but don’t make them your exclusive domain. Keep your mind OPEN!

  37. malagabay says:

    Don’t stop reading Velikovsky or electric universe but don’t make them your exclusive domain.
    Keep your mind OPEN!

    Sounds like good excellent advice to me. Tim

  38. PeterMG says:

    Thank you Tim and Jim. Your answers confirm what I feel and I’m starting to enjoy reading about science again. It will be even better when the scientific establishment are finally banished. It may look further away than ever, but I have this feeling that our technology (that the mainstream confuses with understanding) will deliver the killer blow at some point in the not too distant future.

    It has always been that our predictions about what our world will be like and what products will be the future are always wrong, and whenever government distort the market (as with renewable energy)we get complete duffers that will soon fade from memory in the greater scheme of things. I can’t begin to predict what the technological breakthrough will be but it’s just around the corner I’m sure and will be something totally unexpected.

  39. Jim Coyle says:

    Peter, Good luck in your search for info. I think you would like to check out these other sites. They are much like Malaga Bay, intelligent discussion without the name calling and childish stuff of that nature. Now if you get wacko they will tell you to back off or outright ban you but you disagree with anyone but show why. Try Cosmic Tusk, Watts With That, Catastrophy Of Comets good places for intelligent converse just like here.

  40. Jim Coyle says: I found another item of interest. The pieces keep coming together.

  41. Jim Coyle says: Tim; Another interesting concept that helps point the way towards impact status for Drake Passage

  42. Carsten Sønderup says:

    At least the Russian Academy of Sciences have this short .pdf on subject.

    Click to access 1152.pdf

    also linked to from Wikipedia article footnotes on

  43. Jim Coyle says:

    Carsten; Thank you for your input , I appreciate it. I’ve put this one on the back burner for a while but had just started to review everything again and this should be of use to me. I didn’t even know that Malaga BAY still was carrying the thread on this. And thank you Tim Cullen. Hopefully I’ll be digging back into this concept reasonably soon.

  44. Jim Coyle says:

    Tim Cullen; My Name is Jim Coyle and I had a thread running here about 4 yrs ago. It was on Antarctica and Drake Passage. I had a “finished” copy of the piece that I had sent to you for comment. Since then I had put it on the back burner whilst I was working on another project, much bigger and controversial. I put all my data into a cloud account to clear pc space. My Bad! With a crash on the hard drive all is gone. I was wondering if you may have a copy of the piece I sent you? If so could you please forward it to me at ************ you’re my last chance at not having to do a Do Over from scratch Thank you, you’ve always been quite helpful for me.

  45. johnm33 says:

    I’d sort of settled on this extraordinary bit of bathymetry being just about the best evidence of a ‘cosmic’ event slowing the planet so much that the rocks had actually become fluid, at least in areas that weren’t drenched and cooled either by water covering or evaporating. Of course if had just caught an impactor that’d make even better sense, [if it makes any at all] another rethink ho hum 🙂

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  47. Jim Coyle says:

    Johnm33 Thanks for your input. You got lucky to be able to read on this as I had lost the entire piece. your idea has merit except for the fact that the earth spins from east to west and the impactor would have come from the west heading east, if anything it would have sped up the spin. It may have slowed down the continental drift of South America which is heading to the west but it did create the spin of Antarctica to the east. All this motion has created a tremendous amount of stress on the plate structures in the Drake Passage region. If you have any more comments or questions please feel free to comment. I’ll try to answer as quickly as possible.

  48. johnm33 says:

    Jim, I didn’t make it clear but what i’m thinking about is the amount of heat generated as the planet moves to an orbit more remote from the sun. Stopping the earth spinning generates enough heat to get rivers hot enough to scald and probably to trigger any number of chemical transformations in the ‘crust’, but essentially that’s a surface effect, say the top 1000km at 0deg reducing rapidly to zero beyond what 60-70degN/S, slowing down and adapting to a more remote orbit would affect the whole sphere including the core. If as legends suggest ‘we’ performed a brief dosi-do with Venus during this transition it would be even more violent. One thread of thought is that such an event would precipitate a phase transition in not just platinum group metals but also in other elements with similar specific heat indices, and thus presents an alternative explanation for the iridium layers, not to mention the catalytic effects as such substances rose through the mantle, to become ore bodies? Another thread is native american legends talk of rocks glowing red hot, from there it’s not hard to imagine dry surface or deep rock becoming fluid, allowing the possibility of rapid movement.
    So we have the scenario of moving to a wider orbit, ceasing to spin and a close encounter with another substantial body, impacts and electrial effects, and all of these come down to us in accounts of ancient catastrophies, plus we’d have the oceans rushing to the poles,[and it’s the 20 odd km depth of sediments of the east siberian arctic shelf that got my attention] . Well it’s little wonder that narrowly focussed scientists fail to see the big picture, it’s almost unimaginable.
    Getting back to Drakes passage if the impactor happened to strike prior to the rotation restarting then the eastward rotation of the planet is irrelevent, though looking through the series of the maps [no.16] above there’s small sign of action after, even some that suggest an overturning.
    That said i begin to wonder if the westward move and uplift of south america has it’s cause in the same phenomenon.

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